A couple of weeks ago, my company announced they are closing the location I work in (Green Bay) and consolidating to their new facility in northern New Jersey. Roughly they are looking to have people squared away (whether moving or not) by about October. I have been offered a position in NJ, with a moving package (which I must refund to them if I leave or am fired with cause within 2 years, ouch).

What they offered is kinda lame. Using THA INTARWEBZ for a cost-of-living conversion, it falls about $20,000 short of what I would need to maintain our standard of living. I have been told there is really no room for counteroffers and that according to HR, they offers are "very fair." However it's also apparent to me that I am at least a rank lower than I ought to be, given my experience and education and I am more than likely (over)due for promotion.

So now I'm faced with trying to argue for a promotion to a department head that is retiring with the office closure and considering what would likely be a decline in living standard by moving to northern NJ, as well as exploring other options (ie., applying and interviewing for other positions). SO STRESSED.

Am I doing this right? How have you all dealt with major life change situations of this nature? Advice very appreciated.

Fuck. Fuck! That's messed up. Yeah, northern NJ is kind of pricey. Are they helping you buy or rent? Or just bumping up salary?

Main reason I ask is because NJ has really high property tax, if I'm correctly informed.

well, I would think about how to quantify decreases in the standard of living. Sure, your housing options would be smaller, but you're also moving into an area with a diverse culinary menu. You'll have decent access to Korean, Indian, and Jersey diner food. Not to mention the option to easily explore NYC on your downtime, possibly with the NYC OB crew.

If the package itself is non-negotiable, then again see what other value added benefits you can get from the transfer (besides pushing for a promotion). Extra floating holidays for the year and/or next year for transitional flexibility?

Yes, Northern Jersey can be pretty pricey since Jersey has a very high population density. There are tricks to getting decent gas prices during the week in this toxic environment.

The only negotiating step I could suggest is clearly communicating to your manager/HR department is that you view the move as a sacrifice you expect to be rewarded for when things get better.

Northern NJ is very pricey. If HR is saying their offers are "very fair" then it is your right to ask HR for the places that they have looked at which to compare your value is.

For all it's worth you may be looking at one area, and HR is looking at some shithole like Irvington or the bricks of Newark.

It is kind of unfair because northern NJ has no middle ground living wise so to speak. You either have places like Basking Ridge which are super expensive or shit holes like the Oranges. Then you get a decent area but get crapped on by taxes. It is not the worst but it really isn't the best either.

Where in northern NJ is the facility? Perhaps I can look at what is doable as far as commuting and living in an area that is more in your proce range. Middlesex County and Monmouth County are a little less expensive/can have decent taxes and have some good areas with good schools. They are also easy to commute in and out of because they have a million train lines and the Garden State Parkway is excesible in every direction.

Considering myself and DFBT live in Middlesex County, I can vouch for the school system here. It's very top notch in the state and in the country.

You may also want to consider Jersey City as a place to live. You don't need a car there, everything is light rail (think trolley cars), there's trains/buses to Hoboken, Lower Manhattan, and Midtown. Majority of those that live in Jersey city are IT professionals, Med students, law students, schooling is excellent, and your minutes away from the NYC harbor view.

Rent is around $1000 for a 1 br apartment, 1200-1400 for a 2 BR

This is all excellent info!

To answer questions: they have offered a 20% increase overall, and from what I can tell at least half of that will be eaten by housing increase, because the facility is located in Parisppany.

They will, however, have some housing consultant people made available to us who can help us get an idea of where we can afford to live (fukkake and Rexall - what you have said rings true; HR has basically said "if you look into neighboring prices are more reasonable!" And I've been to my friends' place in East Orange - it's definitely not my kind of place (they bought it so they could have a real house for their dogs and to still be close enough to their families in Brooklyn to visit; I don't have such needs).

It's tough since we have a 1 year old now, and only 1 car (I've been living a hippie dream of commuting to work every morning on foot or on my bike); we have pretty concrete space needs (at least 2 bedrooms, preferably a garage and/or basement) and might have to spring for a second car if we have to cast far afield for an affordable living area.

Middlesex is still an option because if you find a place near Metropark that will take you anywhere in NJ by train.

Your best bet is to look along routes 80 and 280 and see what towns and cities have the best prices. A good starting place is Dover!

Unfortunantely the trains in NJ do suck....unless you're going north or south of NJ.

I have a friend that lives in Parsippany, nice area, very quiet. There are buses and a train station nearby.

Depending on how far your home is from the office, you could still walk or ride a bike. Most NJ towns are cool like that.

Property taxes do suck, plus side our gas is cheaper than 95% of the country and you'll never have to pump your gas again.

This at least makes me feel a little better about the possibility. I think that the offer is going to have to be my fallback, though; not so much for location reasons but because the culture of the place is slowly crushing me.

Alot of the people I work with can be great, but the overarching pressure to get things done FAST rather than RIGHT is getting to me. I care SO MUCH about getting it right and the whole culture seems to encourage conditioned blindness to problems and disorganization and things that make no sense; I am constantly questioning and wanting to fix things - and it feels like I'm the only one who cares.

But, at least I have a clearer picture of some things out in the area if I have to fall back to this as my last hope for employment. And there's a fair chance I will end up SOMEWHERE in NJ because there are a lot of food science jobs out there. Thanks guys!

2 years is completely redic as far as moving expenses goes, especially for current employees. I've never heard more than one year.

If you do start looking around Parsippany area and need info let me know. I was born and raised there

spyrral said:
2 years is completely redic as far as moving expenses goes, especially for current employees. I've never heard more than one year.

Yeah, well, no surprise there, 'cause their offer wasn't terribly plush either. They are offering a signing bonus, but because the cost of living is so high I barely even consider it a plus. On the upside the moving package IS quite comprehensive - much, much more so than the one I had when I came out 4 years ago under different management.

Actually, as it stands right now I will probably be coming out for a "market visit" as they call it, around the 20th this month, because I really need to have a backup in case I can't find anything else, and I may as well be well-informed when I make a choice. I'd take it at least for the short term even if it means I have to cough some money back up if I leave within 2 years (we kept our expenses very low last time and probably can again).