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Gen. Chat “Trying so hard to avoid the "mainstream"” by SEGA GENESIS

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SEGA GENESIS 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Technique scroll: "Flying Glomp" named "Official Proclamation of Newtype USA's Mediocrity"
This is something that's always bugged me about fans or enthusiasts of pretty much anything, from music to anime. The people that revel in obscurity and abandon things once it gets too 'hot'. I can guarantee there are some anime fans that have totally dropped it in the last few years in search of something deeper down the nerd rat hole. It's pretty sad when people focus so much time ensuring that people don't "get them". I can appreciate that some people want something they can call their own, but just like in Harry and the Hendersons, eventually you need to let go and let it live its own life. You can still like Harry, but he needs to find a she-sasquatch.

"I'm a big fan of martial arts movies!"
"Oh man, me too. They're really catching on at school and we started like, 3 clubs already!"
"Well, actually, I lied, I'm more into nunsploitation films and am the president of my 1 man Ruggero Deodato fan club"
"Oh, I have no idea what you're talking about"
"Eeeexcellent"

Then there's the ever popular, "I was into BAND NAME way before they got signed, but they like totally sold out and even though they make the same style of music I just can't condone more than 5 people being into them. Now I'm into this band called 'Rutger Hauer Missile Silo'. They don't have a cd or anything, but I totally overheard them playing in a garage and the singer is unbearably ugly, I love him".

Anyway, not really a point to this post. I was just thinking about this on the way home from school. It's also totally unrelated to anyone here.

Moderator bluefirecracker Says:

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Viewtiful_John 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Cockblast of Vengence named "Open up Alfonso!!"
Being friends with you is getting to be way to cool for me. Fuck you, you sell out.
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SEGA GENESIS 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Technique scroll: "Flying Glomp" named "Official Proclamation of Newtype USA's Mediocrity"
I should also address 'guilty pleasures'. Listen folks, the only thing that should really be considered a guilty pleasure is heroin or crack/cocaine.
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Marronsan 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: MC Hammer Pants. Please, don't hurt 'em! named "these are two legit 2 quit"
i agree, i do not think popularity or lack there of is a reason to like/dislike anything. if it is good it matters not what others think. if you base your decisions on things on what other people think you are a robot poser.
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Kirei the Klown 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Menchi Loaf named "100[%] vegetarian Menchi substitute"
Ooo, doggy. Yeah, I hate that shit. I like to have an esoteric interest as much as the next iconoclast, but it gets really lonely not being able to talk about it with anyone else.

The variant on this is the ubernerd who will like a genre of something and learn it inside-freaking-out so he can out-trivia all but 3 other people on the planet. "Behold, my superior level of geekdom and resulting lack of ANYTHING else interesting about me!!!"

I'll get behind people who say they used to like a band before the such-ans such album, as long as it's PURE COINCIDENCE that the album was their first major widespread release that was well-received by the masses. If you liked Carlos Santana BEFORE he did songs with all the modern rock starts but NOT after, then what the hell, you probably never really liked him at all. Poser.

I spent way too much time liking things totally unrelated to and so far away from what everyone else was into to start diving into the nerd rat hole to escape those with a common interest out of some need to feel superior in my obscure tastes.
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SEGA GENESIS 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Technique scroll: "Flying Glomp" named "Official Proclamation of Newtype USA's Mediocrity"
But it would also be fun to have a few more people that would be like "Oh yeah, Psikyo shooters rock" or whatever. Anyway, Cave shooters are way better than Psikyo games so pbbtt.
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SEGA GENESIS 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Technique scroll: "Flying Glomp" named "Official Proclamation of Newtype USA's Mediocrity"
At any rate, I think "good shit" should be appreciated to the max extent by the max amount of people. I know what you're saying though John.
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Captain Commando 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Map to Secret Ninja Hideout named "Digest and commit seppuku upon discovery"
That, and the people who will avoid something popular just because it's popular - you miss out on so much that way. :|
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SEGA GENESIS 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Technique scroll: "Flying Glomp" named "Official Proclamation of Newtype USA's Mediocrity"
Yeah no kidding, that's another thing I was trying to get across.

I can't believe no one's commented on how awesome a band name 'Rutger Hauer Missile Silo' is.
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bluefirecracker 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Hello Kitty Vibrator named "Total Kitty on Kitty action!!!"
having risen through the ranks of stupid mid-nineties indie rock and film school - this thread fills me with a sense of dread that i have not had since college. My WHOLE academic life was filled with people that only like niche products and small group appeal music/films/ etc. I remember when Pulp Fiction came out... there we were sitting around one night drinking at some party, and this whole crew was like "Fuck him, he was better when no one knew who he was, he hadn't lost his edge... look at resevoir dogs... that movie blew the shit outta pulp fucktion" - QUOTE!!!!

I couldn't agree more with VJ about the stupidity of likeing somehting only becasue it's 'unknown' and then dropping it once it gets lame. One the flip sode though, there are many many many examples of things that went into teh mainstream and lost theior appeal as they tried to satisfy a mass market. But whatever... at the end of the day, everyone's just trying to get paid, so I can't hate on anyone for that shit.. I know I hate being poor.

But music does tend to be better when few people know about a band/act/person. But they normally end up sucking due to label pressure to make a more - "Radio Friendly" sound. So I don't hate on the artist's at all...
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Mark Argent 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Monkey Hand named "and with my monkey hand, I will smythe them"
Violence_Jack posted this at 7/1/2004 11:20:07 AM PST (51 minutes ago)
Now I'm into this band called 'Rutger Hauer Missile Silo'. They don't have a cd or anything, but I totally overheard them playing in a garage and the singer is unbearably ugly, I love him".

I'm so glad to hear that someone appreciates our work.

I think that because popularity is seen by mainstream culture as a benchmark of quality ("if so many people like it, there must be something good about it" or the "a billion Chinese can't be wrong" factor), the reaction of people who don't put a lot of stock in that mainstream is to use obscurity as their personal gauge of quality in the mistaken belief that popularity can only be achieved by appealing to the lowest common denominator. People who don't at least keep an eye on mainstream culture are missing out on the things that inform their subculture, so really they're missing out on full enjoyment of the things they enjoy. I see this a lot in anime fans who "don't bother" with products of Western culture or media, or sf & fantasy fans who don't read nonfiction or contemporary fiction and ignore history and current events because "the real world is boring." It's overspecialization, and specialization is for insects.
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dr_z 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Ticket for the Man Train
Honestly, I prefer the feeling of a small group - there's less anonymity. (booty, you like Bollywood? 1 million cool points to you!). It's probably the elitist factor - i like having that little niche of people i can talk to about a certain thing. Would reading russian lit be as fun if i had to talk about it with the bitch that sits next to me in my math class? Would introducing people to the glory of Kareena Kapoor lose the wow factor?

That said, there is a lot of good in the mainstream. Most niche-markets afe mainstream elsewhere, and hey, if so many people like it, there has to be SOMETHING good about it. Clinging fastly to one or the other causes you to miss out on all sorts of great things.
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Auturgist 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: The Crimson Behelit named "The Egg of the King"
You know, you're right in that it's lame, but I can't deny that it happens to me sometimes. I mean, I'll even RECOGNIZE that it's happening, and still not be able to change the fact that my feelings towards something are changing because of popular interest in it.

Maybe it has to do with association? For instance, maybe you really love Rutger Hauer Missile Silo and it's cool because you associate the music with certain things in your life, but as soon as they become super popular with their first major album and you see screaming fangirls yelling about them on TRL as you flip through the channels, it becomes hard not to associate them with things altogether different and less pleasant. It's not that you don't like THEM anymore, just that you don't like what they remind you of, and the easiest way to avoid being reminded is to avoid listening to them. In the case of many things, I think sometimes they can be crushed under the weight of their own popularity. It's similar to not liking something an ex- used to like because it reminds you of him/her... only when something is super popular, there are countless people you've never even met who are leaving the bad taste in your mouth.

Anyway, you're entitled to your opinions/feelings, and I think if something like that happens, as long as you are fair about it, that's cool. Don't say, "Man, Roy's Silo sucks ass now." when you mean, "Man, all those fucking Silo fangirls suck ass."

Also, in some cases I think it's just a matter of overexposure. If something popular can't be avoided, there's a legitimate reason you might grow to hate it. Afterall, I'd much rather CHOOSE to listen to Roy's Silo than hear it on every station every hour.
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SEGA GENESIS 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Technique scroll: "Flying Glomp" named "Official Proclamation of Newtype USA's Mediocrity"
Good to see you milkshakes agree.
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SEGA GENESIS 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Technique scroll: "Flying Glomp" named "Official Proclamation of Newtype USA's Mediocrity"
Oh, and I won't say this never has happened to me. Anyway, the bottom line is it's just best not to be a prick about it, and if you stop liking something for legitimate reasons, i.e. they legitimately suck now or something, than more power to ya. I was also more frowning on people that dismiss something entirely because it's mainstream, whether or not they used to like it.

There was some more stuff I was gonna comment on in your reply, SD, but I gotta bolt and I'm slowly forgetting anyway.
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Chicken Tank 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Vash's Gun named "Ghetto Blaster"
Yeah, but come on KFD, even you should recognize that old world cock totally kicks more ass than new world cock. Europeans always have the best cocks.
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KungfuDandy 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Clue Stick named "The funny-smelling broom stick"
Dude what are you talking about! Do you know how weird sucking uncut cock feels? (I think you just might). Although I have done it before (and probably will do it again) I must admit that uncut flaccid weenies make me feel weird (no offensive howling mad murphy).

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NinjaWannabe 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Fuuma Shuriken ~ Shadow Windmill named "It's really Naruto in Henge No Jitsu"
Sorry but I don't have time right now to read every post in the thread, so I'm sorry if some one has already said this. I feel however that only caliming to like lesserknown works, of any medium, while simultaniusly shitting on more mainstream movies/music/anime and the people that actualy enjoy it is just pointelss elitism. If a band/arstis/movie/series is that good, it's going to become popular and the mainsrtream crowd just might like it. I for one encourage people to check out anime and music that I like, especialy If I feel that they might enjoy it as well. And neither do I insult thier taste or intellegence simply beacue thy might preffer something that I don't. (well there are a few exceptions but most og those revolve around MTV)
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Fievel 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Sword named "Phallic extension of my lesbian pride"
I could give a flying fuck what's popular, as long as I like it. I won't stop liking mainstream anime just because somebody tells me it's too popular and played out. I like Naruto. I like Escaflowne. I like Evangelion, Cowboy Bebop, Outlaw Star and Rurouni Kenshin. As for music and movies, it's all the same.

The only time pop culture will change my opinion on a series, song, band or whatever, is when it gets so overplayed that I simply can't stand to listen to it anymore. There are some songs out there that I absolutely loved when they first came out, but after the 200th time I heard it on the radio within a span on a few weeks, I just couldn't bring myself you like it anymore.
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KinFreon 15 years ago on 07/01/04
Equipped: Tentacle named "Wang Chung"
Here's what bugs me about anime and manga going mainstream...

Anime and manga were once the proud domain of the "nerd" subculture. A culture that, in itself, was proud and reveled in its' social togetherness despite not being able to mesh well with the rest of the mundane, normal society that shuns us. We were proud to be "otaku". I, along with many others, enjoyed anime and manga because it was a good escape from the majority of humanity that had forsaken us.

Then, our hallowed media goes "mainstream", and all the mundane normals who had once shunned us become interested in our escapist art form. These same people who would once look at us and say "Hey, you suck and we don't like you!" then turn and look at our TV screens to see "Ooh! I like 'Cowboy Bebop'!", only to still turn back at us and say, "By the way, you're still a douchebag."

I remember a time when I could be happy among my otaku friends and escape the painful social rigors of high school. But then when anime became mainstream, and all the hateful scenesters decided "Like, this stuff is cool!", otakudom became a very inhospitable world to me. I felt like the harrowing ordeals that I thought I had left on graduation day had followed me like a lost puppy...that was rabid and wanting to tear me to shreds.

That...is my problem with anime going mainstream.

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